Introduction:
Curtis: Welcome to Conversations with Crosswinds Counseling. I’m your host Curtis Smith. Every week on this podcast, we talk about all things mental health. Sometimes stress or anxiety. Perhaps you’re burned out. Well, this is the podcast for you. We sit down with the wonderful counselors at Crosswinds Counseling, and have a great conversation every week. Let’s dive into this week’s episode.
Podcast #41 | Negative Cycles of Communication:
Curtis: Hi everyone, and welcome to this episode of Conversations with Crosswinds Counseling. I’m Curtis Smith and joining us today for the first time on the podcast is Shanese Passmore, one of the wonderful counselors here at Crosswinds Counseling. Shanese, thank you for being here.
Shanese: Absolutely.
Curtis: Today we’re talking about negative cycles in communication.
Shanese: Yes.
Curtis: That sounds like a big wheighty therapeutic topic. When I say that to you. What does that mean? What are the negative cycles in in our communication styles and our habits?
Shanese: Okay. So, I am an emotion-focused therapist, and what that means is I focus on the patterns right, of communication that we tend to get into when we feel we need to defend ourselves, right, and protect ourselves. So, we recognize that these are cycles that couples, for the most part, are in any relationship I like to say, that we get into a habit of triggers, recognizing those for the most part, and then being intentional about changing those.
Curtis: So, I don’t really understand what you just said, not being a therapist. What are some of those triggers? And then what happens? How do we start to recognize the – here’s the triggers, here’s my response, here’s my behavior – to that. Help me dive into that that last sentence – is especially what you just said about triggers, about what that then leads us to do, and the cycle that we can get into in our communication. How do we understand them? How do we catch them? How do we stop them? How do we reverse them? How do we get them out of here?
Shanese: Absolutely, so I believe that change starts with awareness first and foremost. When you become aware, you’re either intentional about that desired change, or you become avoidant, depending on what it is that’s being triggered. So, the best way I can explain that is through an example. Okay.
Curtis: Great.
Shanese: So I often times ask the question first and foremost. ‘What’s happening,’ or, ‘What’s not happening?’ I’m sorry, ‘What’s happening that you want to happen?’ Right. How do you feel about that? And when that’s not happening, what are you feeling instead? And from there, with what you’re feeling instead of confiding it, how are you showing that since you’re not actually acknowledging or communicating what you’re feeling emotionally. Sometimes those emotions can be quite vulnerable or uncomfortable. We don’t really have the words to really explain it. So sometimes we show it, like frustration, or giving the silent treatment or things like that. And then I ask the questions. ‘Well in that moment how are you feeling about yourself?’ ‘How are you feeling about your partner?’ – or the other person. Right. ‘What are the things that you do to take care of yourself?’
Curtis: What you’re describing, and you even kind of referenced it a time or two, it feels like it mainly applies to marriage, or dating perhaps – in intimate relationships. This seems less likely to be a real issue at work or at church when we’re just having conversations with people, but inside of those intimate relationships – marriage, dating, engagement whatever, why are we so apt to get into these negative cycles? As you were describing, I could see myself, I could hear myself of, yeah, I come into expect – I come into conversations with my wife having these expectations, and when they don’t go the way I want to, I know I might not have used the word ‘triggered,’ but I I know that I’m having a response to that what is it about those relationships that makes this so hard?
Shanese: Yeah, it’s a level of vulnerability, and when it comes to vulnerability, there’s a possibility of potentially being hurt. That’s literally the definition of vulnerability. It’s a risk. Right. And it takes a lot of faith, and when it comes to someone like an intimate partner or your spouse, those relationships are so close, and it’s almost the thought of, ‘What if they see me how I see me?’ So, instead of being willing to be vulnerable, sometimes we like to guard ourselves and protect ourselves from that exposure. Almost, yeah but I want to say also it’s beyond just the intimate relationships, and I know you mentioned – a reference co-workers or colleagues, or your employer even. Right. It’s about your boundary styles. You know your communication style, are you more of a passive or aggressive communicator, or can you be more assertive in your communication? Right. Do you feel that you have more of a rigid boundary style, or do you have that balance of that you know I can be secure within myself that I can confront you know whatever the confrontation or the conflict may be? So, it’s more of a personal or internal dialogue, beyond the other person.
Curtis: You start with awareness. What can we do to help the other person? This is tricky, especially if you’re a spouse. I’m thinking if I notice this in my wife, rather than noticing it in myself, how can I help her get out of this negative cycle of communication delicately? Politely. Gently. So that I don’t take us deeper into something that’s negative.
Shanese: Yeah. That’s why communication is key. Communication is so important. Being mindful and aware of yourself, right, is how you can then bring that awareness to someone else. Not only, you know, acknowledging, ‘Hey, this is the frustration I’m feeling right now,’ or ‘this is the tension that I’m feeling,’ but also, ‘Here’s what I’m recognizing in terms of your behavior,’ right, and that possibility of, ‘I could be wrong here,’ that transparency is super important.
Curtis: Wow. I imagine that most couples you work with are not great at that. Is that true? I mean, I imagine that’s the case.
Shanese: They get there. I’ll say that. They do get there. It’s amazing to see those light bulb moments, or that breakthrough moment, of that, ‘You know what. I could have just did this different.’ ‘I could have just said that.’ So they get there.
Curtis: As a therapist, when you see the light bulb go off, how does that make you feel? That’s got to be a good moment.
Shanese: It is. It is. I just worship in that moment with them. I seriously, I tell them like that’s a win for me as a counselor to see you get to that moment of intentional change, and actually want that for yourself. I often-times tell my clients, whether it’s a couple or individual, ‘What I want for you, is what you want for you.’
Curtis: So, awareness, communication, being transparent and vulnerable, being honest. What else can we do to either stay out of this, avoid the negative cycle, or once we’re in it get out of it what other tips might you have for us.
Shanese: To just move in grace. You know have that grace not only for yourself, but for someone else. Right. I oftentimes tell my couples especially, but when you recognize you’re in that cycle, you don’t have to meet your partner where they are – you know in that negative space, but be aware what’s happening to get us into this dark space. Right. What’s happening to get us to a space where we feel like we’re going backwards? Right. Let’s call it out. Let’s confront it, and that’s a lot of times as I say, avoidance. Well change starts with awareness. Sorry [clears throat]. So being aware of what’s happening right now that’s getting us in such a negative space. Right. Let’s call that thing out so that we don’t feed it, right. Or we don’t go further or deeper into it. We can pull ourselves out of this by for one, calling out what it is.
Curtis: It’s great, great advice. Great tip Shanese. Thank you for being here today on the podcast. Shanese is one of the fantastic counselors at Crosswinds Counseling, and you can find them all at crosswindscounseling.org. You can also, of course, continue to follow us here on the podcast. We hope you join us next time. We’ll see you then.
Outro:
Curtis: Thanks for watching Conversations with Crosswinds Counseling today. Don’t forget to like and subscribe to get more of our podcast, and you can comment in the section below. Perhaps you could share what you’d like us to discuss in future episodes. We’ve got new episodes coming out every week. So, we’ll see you next time on Conversations with Crosswinds Counseling.